Two solid routines that work.

Subject: Re: Two solid routines that work. Sun Apr 17, 2011 4:44 am

grims wrote:

ChimarraoMate, hey there.
I have a couple of questions about the 1st method. So if my max is much more than 6 ,then can i still use this routine simply by deviding the max reps by half. And the second question is: can i use this routine more than 1 time a week, or is it worthless then?

Exactly. If your max is 19, then I would do anywhere from 9-10 reps per set. You should choose a rep range in the 50%-60% range. If you fail durring for 4 sets, then you chose too high. If you don't fail in the 5th or 6th set, then you chose too low.

Read my next response to answer your second question.

Subject: Re: Two solid routines that work. Sun Apr 17, 2011 4:54 am

Uselis wrote:

Nice material Smile

Have couple questions about it:

1.When it says every 5 day it means that Saturday and Sunday is rest days and from Monday routine starts again?
2.Lets say I am able to do 10 strict form pull ups.So I should work with 5x10 until I can reach level where i can complete 10x10?And if its true it should give me 20 repetitions after that in one single set?
3.As you said you mixed with with dips.Could this GVT method be using with 3 exercises in same day like pull ups-dips-push ups but not in one super time but as different work outs or it will lead to overtrain and method will fail?

Thanks for helping

1. No, it means as frequently as every 5 days. So if you do it on Mon, you can work those muscles again on/after Saturday. Most people will do it once a week, but if you are looking to maximize gains, then do a 5 day cycle. Here is what I do:
Day 1: Chest and Back (Wide grip work)
Day 2: Legs and Core
Day 3: Rest
Day 4: Arms and Shoulders (Normal to Narrow Grip Work) You could do as many as 3-4 exercise superset. Just make sure you do 10 sets of each grip to ensure you hit the range of motion 10 times. 2 exercises are plenty though. Something like narrow grip dips facing upright (triceps) superset with close grip chin-ups would be a great choice. Then maybe 2-4 isolation exercises to hit other parts with only 3 sets each.
Day 5: Rest

There will be some overlap on Day 1 and 4, but that is ok, the overlap should happen in a way where you are switching primary muscles for secondary on those days. That type of overlap is good.

2. Yes

3.Do them as supersets with 90 seconds rest between sets. I would not do the pushups as GVT unless you are talking about planche. You may be better off doing regular pushups in the morning when you get out of bed as a recovery routine to get the blood flowing to the muscles.

Subject: Re: Two solid routines that work. Sun Apr 17, 2011 4:59 am

1stratos1 wrote:

I tried the 2nd today , well on wide i was ok done max after in normal as i was w8ing i done much less than my real max but the truth is that i was able to do in every exercise about 1 rep more than if i was doing all time normal with 10 secs so yeah it looks like it works and its an easy and fast way to have a workout i guess Smile

i done the same with Dips, wide push ups , diamons and normal push ups.

Thnx for the routines maybe one day i ll try ur 1st one too Smile

Right on BRO!!! I am doing the same thing today to mix things up. Good minds must think alike Wink

. I run the 5 day GVT cycle, but I put in 2 extra days (i.e. a 7 day cycle so that I can do a complete body focus day with what ever routine I want, then a day of rest and then back to GVT for 5 days.

Subject: Re: Two solid routines that work. Sun Apr 17, 2011 5:08 am

Mdrop wrote:

aight so i tried the max pullup one today, and dam did i get a pump. Instantly. It was pretty awesome but i only got out 2 medium grip chins and 4 narrow chins, i was so dead from the first two max-outs. I made sure to use no kip BTW. I like testing out basically all of the workouts i read on the forum out and this one is def going in my arsenal. Thanks ChimarraoMate!

I am glad you liked it. If you think this one gave you a pump, try the 10 set routine. That one will give you a crazy pump. Recovery will take a bit longer though. You'll be sore an extra day or two.

Subject: Re: Two solid routines that work. Sun Apr 17, 2011 5:21 am

If you have not read about GVT, I recommend you do. A workout will usually look like this:

2 LARGE Compounds exercises superset for 10 sets that are chosen to maximize the number of muscles hit.

Followed by 2-3 isolation Exercises for 3 sets each. This is used to focus on muscles you may not have gotten to with your compound but are still part of the muscles you are focusing on for the workout.

Isolations Work may look like this:
On ARM/Shoulder day, I like to do extra shoulder and rotator cuff work. And on Chest/Back day I like to do some middle back and deep chest (stretching) isolation work.

Posts: 32 Join date: 2011-04-09 Age: 20 Location: Singapore

ChimarraoMate wrote:

Uselis wrote:

Nice material Smile

Have couple questions about it:

1.When it says every 5 day it means that Saturday and Sunday is rest days and from Monday routine starts again?
2.Lets say I am able to do 10 strict form pull ups.So I should work with 5x10 until I can reach level where i can complete 10x10?And if its true it should give me 20 repetitions after that in one single set?
3.As you said you mixed with with dips.Could this GVT method be using with 3 exercises in same day like pull ups-dips-push ups but not in one super time but as different work outs or it will lead to overtrain and method will fail?

Thanks for helping

1. No, it means as frequently as every 5 days. So if you do it on Mon, you can work those muscles again on/after Saturday. Most people will do it once a week, but if you are looking to maximize gains, then do a 5 day cycle. Here is what I do:
Day 1: Chest and Back (Wide grip work)
Day 2: Legs and Core
Day 3: Rest
Day 4: Arms and Shoulders (Normal to Narrow Grip Work) You could do as many as 3-4 exercise superset. Just make sure you do 10 sets of each grip to ensure you hit the range of motion 10 times. 2 is plenty though. Something like narrow grip dips facing upright (triceps) superset with close grip chin-ups would be a great choice. Then maybe 2-4 isolation exercises to hit other parts with only 3 sets each.
Day 5: Rest

There will be some overlap on Day 1 and 4, but that is ok, the overlap should happen in a way where you are switching primary muscles for secondary on those days. That type of overlap is good.

2. Yes

3.Do them as supersets with 90 seconds rest between sets. I would not do the pushups as GVT unless you are talking about planche. You may be better off doing regular pushups in the morning when you get out of bed as a recovery routine to get the blood flowing to the muscles.

Quick question! On Day 1 you would do wide grip pullups superset with dips, which is 1 superset. Then on Day 4 where you have your arms and shoulder days, you would do superset with 3-4 exercises, so essentially, its 2 supersets for the arms and shoulder days? (cos 2 exercises form a superset)

Subject: Re: Two solid routines that work. Sun Apr 17, 2011 8:20 am

ChimarraoMate wrote:

Most people will do it once a week, but if you are looking to maximize gains, then do a 5 day cycle. Here is what I do:
Day 1: Chest and Back (Wide grip work)
Day 2: Legs and Core
Day 3: Rest
Day 4: Arms and Shoulders (Normal to Narrow Grip Work) You could do as many as 3-4 exercise superset. Just make sure you do 10 sets of each grip to ensure you hit the range of motion 10 times. 2 is plenty though. Something like narrow grip dips facing upright (triceps) superset with close grip chin-ups would be a great choice. Then maybe 2-4 isolation exercises to hit other parts with only 3 sets each.
Day 5: Rest

There will be some overlap on Day 1 and 4, but that is ok, the overlap should happen in a way where you are switching primary muscles for secondary on those days. That type of overlap is good.

In general, when you're not doing GVT, do you also follow this split when doing bodyweight only workouts (Specific muscle groups on a given day, once a week, and then proper rest days in between, sort of bodybuilding style but replaced with calisthenic movements)? If you do, how have your gains been with strength and size?

Subject: Re: Two solid routines that work. Sun Apr 17, 2011 9:43 am

fkncody wrote:

ChimarraoMate wrote:

Most people will do it once a week, but if you are looking to maximize gains, then do a 5 day cycle. Here is what I do:
Day 1: Chest and Back (Wide grip work)
Day 2: Legs and Core
Day 3: Rest
Day 4: Arms and Shoulders (Normal to Narrow Grip Work) You could do as many as 3-4 exercise superset. Just make sure you do 10 sets of each grip to ensure you hit the range of motion 10 times. 2 is plenty though. Something like narrow grip dips facing upright (triceps) superset with close grip chin-ups would be a great choice. Then maybe 2-4 isolation exercises to hit other parts with only 3 sets each.
Day 5: Rest

There will be some overlap on Day 1 and 4, but that is ok, the overlap should happen in a way where you are switching primary muscles for secondary on those days. That type of overlap is good.

In general, when you're not doing GVT, do you also follow this split when doing bodyweight only workouts (Specific muscle groups on a given day, once a week, and then proper rest days in between, sort of bodybuilding style but replaced with calisthenic movements)? If you do, how have your gains been with strength and size?

Not always. Sometimes I change the splits, sometimes I just do upper body one day and lower body another day. I rarely do full body, but have done that too. If I am not doing GVT then I recover faster because I will only do 2-4 sets of an exercise.

I like how you say Bodyweight only... I weigh between 196-205 with my cloths on, and depending on my eating. With a lot of moves, that is plenty heavy. I get my best gains from bodyweight training. That is because when you do compounds that your body was meant to do, it always grows better. I also have a 35lb daughter and a 90lb son who love to hang on my back while I do pull-ups and dips. If you really want a challenge use dumbbells, weight vests, backpacks with water jugs, or a belt with a chain to hold plates.

Today I was doing Dips with my son on my back, so that was about 290 lbs. And 48 inch wide grip pull-ups with my daughter, putting me at 235 lbs.

Subject: Re: Two solid routines that work. Sun Apr 17, 2011 10:10 am

Strive92 wrote:

Quick question! On Day 1 you would do wide grip pullups superset with dips, which is 1 superset. Then on Day 4 where you have your arms and shoulder days, you would do superset with 3-4 exercises, so essentially, its 2 supersets for the arms and shoulder days? (cos 2 exercises form a superset)

Ya, I guess technically 2 exercises in a superset, thanks for the correction. I should have been more careful in my explanation. So I was suggesting that you could do a Giant Set instead of a superset. But honestly a superset is more than enough. I have found that because smaller muscles are involved, arm day is not as challenging to your ATP stores as chest/back day is. These exercises are good in this split:
Day 1: Superset Wide Grip Pull-ups with Wide Grip Dips chest down. For isolations I'll superset Really Wide grip Dips Chest down with a chest up Body Row (to hit the middle back)
Day 4: Narrow Grip Chin-ups superset with Narrow Grip Dips Chest and body upright. For Isolations I'll do Body Weight External Rotations superset with Handstand Shoulder Presses.

Posts: 32 Join date: 2011-04-09 Age: 20 Location: Singapore

Thanks for the clarification, gonna start this GVT workout next week.
Just did the second workout that you described, i can do 14 pullups with good form, but after i maxed out the wide grip pull ups, i could only manage a pathetic 4 normal grip pull, 2 normal grip chin and 2 narrow grip chin. And the second set got even worse, i could only do 2 wide grip pullup and i was spent. Such a huge drop in reps, Is this normal when first starting this workout?

Subject: Re: Two solid routines that work. Tue Apr 19, 2011 1:48 pm

Strive92 wrote:

Thanks for the clarification, gonna start this GVT workout next week.
Just did the second workout that you described, i can do 14 pullups with good form, but after i maxed out the wide grip pull ups, i could only manage a pathetic 4 normal grip pull, 2 normal grip chin and 2 narrow grip chin. And the second set got even worse, i could only do 2 wide grip pullup and i was spent. Such a huge drop in reps, Is this normal when first starting this workout?

That is a pretty big drop off. Yes the drop off after the First set of wide grip pull-ups is usually pretty big, but then it sort of has a constant small fall off from there. It sounds like you have a strong back, but weaker arms. It could also be because your CNS has not adapted to the routine yet, which in that case is good, because you will get some pretty good increases if you repeat the exercise 1-2 times a week.

Also, you may be very low on glycogen. Try to increase your glycogen stores with Creatine and and eat more fruits. Especially immediately after training. You need to get more energy in the muscles so that they can keep up with heavy work.

Your 3rd set will likely look like 3-4 reps wide, 2 reps for both normal grip, and 1-2 reps close chins.

Posts: 50 Join date: 2011-04-20

have to try this type of workout next week after easter! Anyway, I think I'll get tired after the first 2 max sets. But still gotta try them!

Thanks a lot!

Posts: 32 Join date: 2011-04-09 Age: 20 Location: Singapore

ChimarraoMate wrote:

Strive92 wrote:

Thanks for the clarification, gonna start this GVT workout next week.
Just did the second workout that you described, i can do 14 pullups with good form, but after i maxed out the wide grip pull ups, i could only manage a pathetic 4 normal grip pull, 2 normal grip chin and 2 narrow grip chin. And the second set got even worse, i could only do 2 wide grip pullup and i was spent. Such a huge drop in reps, Is this normal when first starting this workout?

That is a pretty big drop off. Yes the drop off after the First set of wide grip pull-ups is usually pretty big, but then it sort of has a constant small fall off from there. It sounds like you have a strong back, but weaker arms. It could also be because your CNS has not adapted to the routine yet, which in that case is good, because you will get some pretty good increases if you repeat the exercise 1-2 times a week.

Also, you may be very low on glycogen. Try to increase your glycogen stores with Creatine and and eat more fruits. Especially immediately after training. You need to get more energy in the muscles so that they can keep up with heavy work.

Your 3rd set will likely look like 3-4 reps wide, 2 reps for both normal grip, and 1-2 reps close chins.

Yeah i think you're right, most probably i have weaker arms. Still searching for a good routine to hit them hard. Gonna include more fruits into my diet too. Have you tried to integrate this back workout into your GVT-based workout before?

Posts: 678 Join date: 2011-03-23 Age: 23 Location: MALAYSIA

i gave GVT a try yesterday. with 5x10sets, 5kilos backpack and doing it L-seated.

woke up with a sore back. this is definitely good stuff. Wink

we need more smart workouts like this. keep it coming chim mate!

Subject: Re: Two solid routines that work. Thu Apr 21, 2011 6:26 am

Strive92 wrote:

[Yeah i think you're right, most probably i have weaker arms. Still searching for a good routine to hit them hard. Gonna include more fruits into my diet too. Have you tried to integrate this back workout into your GVT-based workout before?

Not sure what you mean by "this back workout". Mixed grip will not work for GVT. You have to stick with a single grip and range of motion for 10 sets. If the question is--have I used body weight training for GVT?--then yes. I'll usually superset a wider or normal grip weighted pull-up or chin-ups with GVT on chest/back day. For chest I'll do some kind of press exercise that hits the chest. Sometimes a wide grip leaning forward dip with my chin tucked and touching my collar bone.

For arm day, I like to do tricep narrow grip dips superset with narrow grip chin-ups.

You should try GVT if you need pure mass and strength gains. There is no other workout that works as well as GVT does for that. With the 90 seconds rest and alternating exercise you'll have little to no drop off until the 5th or 6th superset and then it should only be 2-3 reps that will drop off.

One more note, once you have chosen a grip (and added weight if needed) for a particular exercise, then stick with that exercise for 6 weeks (or 6 cycles if you are running 5 day cycles). You will want to be able to measure the improvement in that exercise over a 6 cycle run of GVT. And again, do not run GVT for more than the 6 weeks, take a 3 week break from GVT and do something else to allow full recoverery. You will notice a lot of growth durring the recovery phases.

Last note: Eat to recover when you are on GVT. Your body cannot grow rapidly if you are not eating to support the growth. The only exception is if you have plenty of built in energy from "fat", then run a high protein and moderate fat diet, but remove the carbs except for immediately after your workouts.

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Two solid routines that work.

Two solid routines that work.

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